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So, in real terms, you are right . Prices have collapsed. In nominal terms, they are stable. But the perception is completely different. People think we are in a state of massive inflation. Yes. This is, well, we have another technology that has the same colossal impact as the ones you mentioned. Let me guess.
And this conference, it, well, celebrated it with all sorts of compelling speeches, it's graphene, can I, two-dimensional yes, and, and, and because and it confirms all of your, it reinforces all of your five different converging technologies, and, in fact, will make them possible. So, one of the, and you know, we at Universal Matter are looking at this, we just started a venture fund.
So we are very interested in this materials science at very early stages. So, just to add a little investment experience to our discussion. Yes. Now it reminds me a bit of nanotechnology in the past, I remember we were chasing it, chasing it, and what came of it ? What happened was that the big industrial conglomerates bought up all these companies, those small companies, and they became the biggest beneficiaries.
Another thing, we studied materials science; it is difficult to scale. This is the most important thing. And the third thing—our biggest mistake, I think, in the last 10 years, we'll be 10 years old in January, in terms of assumptions for technology—is 3D printing . When you deal with the aerospace or automotive industries, the regulatory environment is so demanding and grueling.
The one thing, one of the biggest sources of hope for all technologies that are facing regulatory hurdles that really shouldn't exist—some should, some shouldn't— is regulatory arbitrage, meaning China or some other country that's competing , Israel, yes, Israel, and innovation solves problems, so hopefully it will work there too.
But this regulatory arbitrage is becoming very important. I think we in this country should be ashamed of everything related to blockchain technology, especially the world of Bitcoin. I think it's very politicized. So we have to take the politics out of this. You know, I've been rethinking Bitcoin a bit in light of the radical deflationary forces that are manifesting through time prices.
Bitcoin's deflationary properties , its limit, may not be as devastating as I imagined. And this provides an additional boost because real prices are actually falling as fast as the Bitcoin cap reduces supply. So, the rate of supply growth. So Bitcoin still has a chance. But I think there will be other changes in Bitcoin , or some kind of evolution that could turn it into real money, by which all fiat currencies will eventually be valued through their time prices fixed in Bitcoin as it develops.
So when Art looked at the document in 2015, it was when Bitcoin was worth $250. It's worth 35,000 now. Um, his first reaction was, you know, I've been waiting for this. I've been waiting for this ever since we gave up. Reaction. This is Art Laffer saying: I'm Art Laffer. Yes. I've been waiting for this since we abandoned the gold exchange standard in 1971.
I've been waiting for this—a rules-based monetary and credit system . "Right now, I don't think that's the right rule," he said. Keeping in mind that this is a rule of money quantification. Yes. But they will do everything right. We have now recorded two more podcasts with him . And, as I mentioned, he is 83 years old.
By the way, I have one. OK. May God protect you. May God protect you. I never have, and you know, innovation keeps us all young, right? So, I...he's like a child . I've never seen him more excited because he said we have a chance to take the Fed out of this equation. We have a chance, yes. return to private money.
And he also said on our podcast, Lizzie, I think, I think, it's... I don't know, it's one of our podcasts, type in " Art Laffer, Bitcoin," and you'll find, he said there's a way, and this is in response to one of your panel's questions: there's a way, through the institutionalization of Bitcoin and the involvement of many decentralized players, that it will become a price rule.
by its nature, if it becomes large enough. I remember telling him that when it was $250. So, the market capitalization was $6 billion . Today it is 500 billion. As he spoke, I told him it sounded like a great idea. And he said: that's right . And I asked, " Well, how big is it?" And he said, "Well, how big is the US monetary base?" And then it was $4.5 trillion.
Today it is $8 trillion. Uh , that's a really great idea. Yes. Well, that's right, Art. Um, do you consider yourself a supply-side investor? Is that it, um Yes, I think so. Yes. Supply creates its own demand. New creation. Certainly. And I will also tell the story of how we first met. Um , the first time I met you was in 1980, and no, you wouldn't remember, I was 20, early 20, I had just moved to New York, and none of the portfolio managers could make it to this dinner, and you were there, and we wanted to be introduced, so I was given the first chance, and it was the first dinner I ever went to, a professional dinner.
Yes. it was you, and I was amazed, and I was the only one that when it was I was amazed because I got into this business for the reasons that you spoke about very freely that night. I got into business, I first started working at Capital Group on the West Coast because I thought, "Wow, all these people are getting paid to learn, and not just learn, but to learn how the world is going to work." And you know, you were talking about the future and taking people to a place in time where they weren't used to living, and I loved that.
I liked it. Good. Well, uh, how could I miss you? But anyway, well, that's great. What, what, what are your, um uh how do you plan to change your investment company? How is it, how will it respond to all these convergences, your own organization? Yes. I- how are we going to try to avoid destruction because the traditional financial world is going to be destroyed.
Well, we believe, and if you're talking specifically about the financial world, we know that we have to integrate into the world of digital wallets. We believe that people will manage their financial lives through digital wallets. WeChat Pay was, you know, the very first version of this. I just listened to Block's earnings report today .
This is what they are going to do. So we need to find a way to all these digital wallets. Regarding ARK in general, we are launching crypto funds. We just started a venture fund, but we try to stay true to our brand and roots. Focused exclusively on breakthrough innovations . This is true. Hmm, very transparent.
In the traditional venture world, this is not the case. Very transparent, and also in the crypto world . We are focused on democratization. So we don't just provide our research for free. We have a social media strategy, social marketing, and now social distribution. So our venture fund can reach people through an app, the Titan app.
And they can join our fund for just $500. So young people , and this is the question we are asked most often. Yes. Yes. So we are excited about the assets that are currently in the fund. I think our willingness to share research, which became part of presentations at many venture firms, gave us a seat at the negotiating table even more than I expected, and I'm very grateful for that.
You deserve it . One question " off the agenda". Charlie Munger said yesterday that BYD in China is ahead of Tesla in production, making greater strides, and he is willing to bet on BYD against Tesla. Well, they have had BYD in their portfolio for a long time. Look, there will be a Chinese champion.
The government will not allow Tesla to become China's electric car champion. Tesla can be a major exporter of high-end products, which is what they aspire to be. They don't want to be just exporters of cheap goods, so for now they're happy. BYD did a great job. BYD's success is partly due to the same reasons as Tesla's success.
They both decided to take advantage of the consumer electronics learning curve, right? While most automakers did not believe that it was possible to use batteries from mobile phones or laptops by placing them in the bottom of the car. They thought it would lead to fires and disaster. And, of course, these two companies are starting to change.
They have to change because their learning curve may be steeper, but the costs start at a much higher point. So I believe that BYD and Tesla are the two market leaders.
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