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so the narrative on bitcoin has shifted from a means of payment to a store of value for some it's not so much used as a currency as a it is digital gold institutions and public companies are buying this thesis and we're seeing bitcoin hit records as a result what do you make of this institutional and corporate interest in bitcoin underlined by tesla's 1.5 billion bitcoin investment on monday well as you suggested the bitcoin and crypto is not a means of payment it's not the currencies not the unit of account it's not the scalable means of payment is not a single numerator now people say it's an asset but think of it what are assets assets like stocks bonds and real estate give you income or give you some use like a real estate and therefore they have a reason they have a capital gain gold doesn't give you income but there's other uses industrial utility in jewelry and therefore has also some value and it used to be used as a means of payment in the case of bitcoin it doesn't have any income it doesn't have a news it doesn't have any utility so what's the value of it based on what based on no intrinsic value and purely a speculative bubble that's why i argue that bitcoin like all the other coins are worth zero actually negative given the hogging of energy and their mental cost if it was a carbon tax on crypto the value of these assets will be negative so what's the fundamental value what's the use what's the utility that justifies the cattle game none is a speculative bubble that is based on pumping up spoofing wash trading and manipulation by tether there's a total scam so for institutional investors saying we're gonna invest into into crypto doesn't make any sense you have a failing company that had a flat stock market like microstrategy for a decade and its head was a coke addict decided then to back the entire house on bitcoin that's that's irresponsible behavior there's not going to be any corporate ahead it's going to put this cash as you pointed out clearly into something that is so volatile you put your cash in something this stable and for somebody like elon musk who knows that there's a market impact to manipulate first like an individual position to bitcoin pump the price up and then say that tesla has invested and tesla doesn't make money yet it's also irresponsible and it's market manipulation the sec should be looking to people that have a market impact that manipulate the price of assets that's also criminal behavior totally criminal enterprise federer is a criminal enterprise and a bunch of whales and insiders are manipulating the price of bitcoin and other coins day in the out that's a fact dr rabini uh always array of sunshine of course but we the question about tether is this we've known for a while now that it has been backed entirely by dollars um did something like 70 some odd percent uh that that came out a while ago there's there's been questions about it it's backing for some time for several years yeah it's still trading on par with us dollar uh conceivably they have enough assets at least for a while to keep the peg going with with the dollar uh so how much of a real worry is it for crypto if you know if there's even a small run on on tether if you will well first of all we don't know what is back 70 percent or not uh the the lawyers say 70 percent but we have no idea doesn't mean any any absolute uh independent audit of it we also know they're really issuing literally at the exponential rate and new tedders literally in the last year alone something like 25 billion in the last few weeks a billion per week so it looks like they're getting desperate and it's a typical ponzi scheme in which i'd maintain the value of something by issuing more of it and more of it and so on we know that how different is that the number of them how different is that from what's going on right now with the money printing happening in washington well the money printing in washington is happening at the rate that is much less than the one of the issuance of fiat by trader and other coins if you look at the chart of it i mean literally the case of trader is exponential first of all secondly central banks if you know that asset they're matching the liabilities for every dollar of currency or excess reserves that are in the central bank balance sheet there is an asset foreign reserves or gold or treasury assets so the idea that fiat currencies are not backed by anything is utterly false if you look at the balance sheet of any central bank their assets and their liabilities and actually there is a positive net worth most of the time well in the case of tether there is nothing backing it the idea is even 70 is not true and we know that every fixed exchange rate that is based on not fully backing and not fully collateralized eventually collapses the entire history monitor history is that every fixed exchange that is not backed as collapse is only a matter of time and the trigger is going to be when the indictments of trader and big phoenix are going to occur and it's only a matter of time this year because we know their investigation is occurring let's move to central bank digital currencies for a moment we know that china is moving quite rapidly in this area do you think that the u.s dollar will remain the world's reserve currency well i think that the chinese gonna go ahead the rich bank is gonna go ahead the ecb is going to go ahead and until now the us was behind the curve but they realized that the chinese have a plan to dominate the global financial system it's their e-commerce is their own platform of private payment system like ali paying which at pay and that's going to be the ermb and it's only a matter of time we're going to phase out cash all over the world and if the u.s wants to maintain the role of the u.s dollar as a major global reserve currency they will have to move to an e-dollar the problem with that is that people get excited in the crypto world when central banks are talking about a central bank digital currency the central bank digital currency first of all has nothing to do with blockchain it's going to be private it's going to be centralized it's going to be permission it's going to be based on a bunch of trusted authority verifying transaction has nothing to do with blockchain there's nothing with crypto and as a payment system is going to dominate not only crypto that has absolutely no payment services but also any private form of payment system it is digital from credit cards to uh bank deposits to alley k to which i pay to venmo to square to paypal and so on because it's going to be cheap it's going to be instantaneous it's going to be instant down it's clearing and settlement and it's going to be a system it's going to dominate any form of private money so if and when central bank currencies are going to be introduced the problem is going to be any form of private digital payment system is going to be crowded out starting with crypto that doesn't have any payment service in the first place dr ray beanie so it sounds like you believe that the technology underlying bitcoin at least is sound and that governments and central banks around the world will adopt it and if that's the case what happens to privacy and you've also mentioned a something about negative rates you know becoming the norm tell us about that first of all i said the opposite on the technology the central bank digital currencies will not be based on blockchain they're going to be private not public they'll be centralized not decentralized they're going to be permission not permissionless they're going to be based on a bunch of central banks and private banks who are trusted verifiers of the transaction rather than being trustless so the technology is not going to be blockchain it's not going to be crypto that's my point secondly the advantage of having a central bank digital currency is that right now if there is a very severe economic recession central banks cannot go very negative with the policy rates that's why they do quantitative easing they do credit easing because if you go lower than say 75 basis points people are going to switch their excess reserves into cash that there's a nominal zero interest rate so they are not going to pay the tax however if you phase out cash then you have no option then keeping your money in the digital form and then the negative policy rate and the severe recession or depression can go to minus one minus two minus three minus four minus five whatever you want it to be so if and when that happens and if there is a recession this is severe enough central bank digital currents are gonna allow you to have much more easy monetary policy with much more negative policy rates that's the direction we're going to go faster is there anything that could happen that would change your mind about bitcoin um so far no as i said it's not a unit of account it's not the means of payment it's not a single numerator it's not a stable store of value i i don't believe there's gonna be an and with proof of work you get five transactions per second and if it was to be adopted as a means of payment you'll have deflation because the quantity of it is limited in the long run if you want to create a digital currency that actually works as a means of payment its growth has to be the growth of nominal gdp so the demand can be satisfied by supply that increases as much as nominal gdp meaning inflation target plus the growth rate of the economy otherwise you're gonna get permanent deflation of every price and goods and services so fundamentally flawed even from that point of view
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